[olug] [OT] IT degrees

[Obi-Wan]

I was off work today, so I'm kinda late to the game here, but I have to
put in my two cents.  For a little background, I've been doing programming
(C, C++, perl, HTML) and Unix sysadmin (Linux/Solaris/AIX) for about 20
years now.  I have a BS and MS in CS from UNL.  There was nothing called
a "comp engr" degree back in the early 90's, but if there had been, that's
what my course load most closely resembled.  I minored in EE.  While I've
never had the final say on new hires, I have had significant input on them
for some time now.

The education you need depends greatly on what you want to do.  As
others have said, if you're just starting out and want to do significant
programming (web programming and 10K-line toy projects don't count),
then you need a 4-year computer degree.  On paper, an associates degree
is only marginally better than no degree at all.  That said, a BS (or
even MS) certainly doesn't guarantee that you'll be good at
programming.  Most schools, UNL included, turn out plenty of idiots.
It's still up to you to learn what you're being taught.  However, if
you're just starting out, you're extremely unlikely to get hired for a
large scale programming project if you haven't been taught a lot of the
theory.  A couple community college classes that teach you the syntax of
C++ or Java do you no good when you have to wrangle 3,000,000 lines of
source code for an engineering application.  I've been in that situation
at two separate jobs, and I've seen people succeed and fail.

If you want to do system or network administration, that's a whole
different story.  A 4-year computer degree will certainly help you
understand the "when & why" of sysadmin, but I don't think it helps
enough to be worth the time commitment -- especially for an entry
level position.  The biggest problem with them is that the sysadmin
field changes so quickly, a class you took three years ago probably
won't be very relevent by the time you get a job.  For sysadmin, I
think a quick associates is good to get you familiar with the concepts,
but it should be followed by some certifications to prove that you
actually know something.  As with programming, an associates is worthless
on paper by itself.  It's just a quick way to learn the basic fundamentals
so that you can then jump into the certifications.  It's the certifications
that will make you look good.

(FYI, the word on the street is that the Cisco & Red Hat certifications
are the most valuable, in terms of both applicability to the real world
and of the salary that holders of said certs make.  I've taken a couple
RHCA classes myself and can vouch for them.)

Of course, in both of these scenarios, having lots of real world
experience still makes the most difference to a prospective employer.
It's good to have the paper to go along with the experience, though,
and it's easier to get the paper than the experience.

I recently left a job as a senior Unix/network sysadmin at a hospital
with an I.T. staff of about 60.  About a dozen of us were Windows,
Unix, or network sysadmins.  Of that 60, I'm pretty sure I was the only
one that had a 4-year computer degree (never mind my MS).  The dozen
admins all had varying amounts of work experience (some 25+ years), but
none had more than an associates degree in computers.  A couple of them
had some low-level Microsoft certifications.  On numerous occasions, it
was obvious that the underlying theory I had learned in my upper level
BS & MS courses gave me more insight into some issues and greater problem
solving ability than any of my coworkers had with their associates degrees
and on-the-job experience.  The admins were all bright people, but the
difference in education did make a difference from time to time.

Oh, and to the UNL freshman who stated that the CS program was worthless:
you don't have a clue yet.  You won't get to the really good classes for
another 2-3 years.  It's the senior & graduate level classes that really
make the program worth while.  You just have to pay your dues for a couple
years until you understand enough of the basics to keep up in those
later classes.

Was all that worth only two cents?  Probably...

-- 
Ben "Obi-Wan" Hollingsworth                             obiwan at jedi.com
   The stuff of earth competes for the allegiance I owe only to the
     Giver of all good things, so if I stand, let me stand on the
       promise that You will pull me through.  -- Rich Mullins